That’s correct. I simply swapped the 2015 GWM with one from a 2018 as from my understanding was that 2017+ fusion/MKZ GWM could understand more CAN messages than the years prior.
The APIM is not talking on the CAN-BUS. But, also you loose the FCIM when you have the Sync 4 APIM installed. This is still a red flag to me, which needs to be resolved.
There is really no difference in the GWM’s from 2015 to 2018, except for the firmware. Updating the firmware on the 2015 GWM would probably get the same result. However, the 2018 GWM may not be enough for Sync 4. I don’t know if this is true as I have no way to test it, but perhaps others can chime in who have retrofitted Sync 4 to their Sync 3 CGEA 1.3 vehicles.
The FORScan team has just not tested your vehicle so it is not listed. Being CGEA 1.3, it should not be an issue, normally.
Yes.
I have spoke with ForScan support and they were able to give me a custom test build that supports Sync 4 on my 2015 MKZ. I am now able to see the module and have been going through my As Built values to try and match up as much as I can with the previous Sync 3 values. FCIM still doesn’t function with Sync 4, neither does my DDM/PDM. When I simply swap the sync 4 module with the sync 3 one(pins 53/54 still removed), everything functions as you’d expect. I’ve enabled all the Integrated Control Panel As Built values and set it to CAN network with no success
Ok so I got a mostly working setup. As built for the Nav unit is below. No DTCs and all functions work. Only issue I am having now relates to the maps. When driving the maps are not accurate. Has something to do with the gyro I think as turns are exaggerated. For instance if I am making a 90 degree turn, the maps will depict a greater then 90 turn and will go down the road at a angle until it breaks free of the road and continues into nowhere…. Any ideas on how to fix?
Make sure the data in 7D0-05-02 thru 7D0-07-04 is complete and correct. The NAV system uses this data to calculate the movement of the vehicle as well as GPS. There is data missing.
Is a Maverick FWD? Check the Drive Type setting.
You have the APIM set for a Telematics Control Unit (TCU), Hotspot Capable Modem (HCM) present, but NO GPS from the TCU. Is this the original TCU that came with the vehicle? Does the TCU serial number display on the Sync 4 “About” screen?
Did you install a new GPS antenna when you swapped in the Sync 4 APIM? When you go into the diagnostic menu and look at the satellite signal strength and number of satellites, what does it show?
Ok got it working. Pulled over what I could correlate with sync 3 into blocks 7D0-05-02 through 7D0-07-04. Unfortunately didn’t see a correlation with vehicle length and height in sync 3 but all others transferred over. Had to change it to internal gyro and enable GPS from TCU in order for it to work properly. I’m using the OEM antenna that came from sync 2.5.
The Mavericks can be FWD or AWD. It can display the Modem Serial on screen. When a master reset is preformed it will reset the TCU/FordPass. That said, it will not allow FordPass to be reactivated. Not sure if that’s just because it can’t talk with an HS4 TCU or that’s another ABD value to change. Only other small issue is that the + button in the rear camera will work but it won’t change to a - and go back to normal view. I have to go out of reverse and back into it to reset the view.
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I do not know if you will get FordPass to activate with the existing TCU and Sync 4. You might have to delete the vehicle from the account and start over to get it to activate, if it will.
Maybe you could activate HS4-CAN on the APIM and add the wiring to the GWM, if needed. But since the TCU serial number already shows on the APIM, the modules are communicating.
Antenna should be fine then.
NAV units use internal gyro on all Sync APIMs.
If you turn off GPS from the TCU, does the NAV work properly? If the NAV does not, then this definitely indicates that the APIM and TCU are talking.
You could try a LIN “add new module” task in FORScan. It might reset the command. Unknown.
I have heard of this happening in Sync 3 but have never heard of the solution.
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Disabling GPS from TCU did nothing to the behavior of the maps. It actually got rid of the one DTC I had, “unable to communicate with TCU”. I believe I also might have solved the FordPass issue. I went into Sync 4 settings, mobile apps, FordPass and noticed that everything was disabled. I enabled what I wanted including notifications and now the FordPass app properly updates with vehicle info and such. So it seems the APIM has at least limited communication with the TCU without HS4. This makes sense to me since the original Sync 2.5 did not have HS4 either.
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I think that your TCU is speaking HS3-CAN since the vehicle was equipped with Sync 2.5 from the factory.So in this case there is no need for HS4-CAN or the associated setup. The FordPass settings needed to be activated, since this is a new APIM, that makes sense. FordPass should work at this point.
So are all of the DTC’s gone now?
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Yes all DTCs are gone. Just went out again and can confirm that the nav issue is 100% fixed. Only things not working are Wi-Fi and vehicle hotspot. Enabling customer connected will give me the Wi-Fi menus in connectivity but it is not able to find any Wi-Fi and it breaks wireless CarPlay. The vehicle hotspot displays in settings but is blank when you click on the icon.
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From what I have seen, all of the Sync 4 retrofits that I know of, the Sync unit WIFI does not work. That does not mean that it can’t work, it’s just that no one has gotten it to work that I am aware of. As far as the WIFI Hotspot, this is thru the TCU, and you need to have a subscription with AT&T for that to be enabled.
Does your wireless CP/AA work now?
Yea wifi is not a big deal to me as long as there is a manual way to update the APIM. Vehicle hotspot is a non issue as well since I do not ever plan on using it.
And yes wireless CarPlay is working flawlessly.
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Looks like all my issues are related to MSCAN not functioning when Sync 4 APIM is installed. Simply removing the APIM connector brings back my FCIM, DDM and PDM. Anyone have any ideas?
There won’t be for retrofits
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In probably going back to sync 3 soon just need to get a aawireless or similar as love wireless aa
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You have a wiring short or termination in the wiring or on/in the Sync 4 module.
Disconnect the MS-CAN wiring from the APIM connector and then plug it into the Sync unit. If you don’t lose the modules and CAN connectivity, then the issue is in the unit. Look at the rear connector and see if you have bent pins, etc. Maybe a metallic piece of junk got in the connector?
Everything looks good there from a wiring perspective. I’m going to try and remove each MSCAN device one at a time and see if it makes a difference. Aside from the DSM, DDM, PDM and FCIM on MSCAN, I also have a legacy (Pre Sync3) GPSM and RTM (CD player). I suspect the issue to be related to the GPSM as the others who have got sync 4 working in fusions are on 17+ models which do not have the GPSM behind the gauge cluster.
I don’t see how the GPSM would matter other than confusing the clock and the compass display. I do not think it would not cause the issue you are having specific to the Sync 4 APIM being in place. The stock MS-CAN wiring is fine, this is proven with the Sync 3 unit installed.
You can disconnect the GPSM, which will mess up the compass on the IPC, and see if there is a messaging conflict with the GPSM and the Sync 4 APIM. If it works this way, you can either leave the GPSM disconnected and have no compass in the IPC, or set the appropriate value for the master clock in the APIM, which should already be set to the BCM.
EDIT: I looked for the master clock setting in Sync 4 and there apparently is no setting for this any longer. So if the GPSM is the issue, you will have no compass in the IPC.
I was able to successfully get my major issues fixed, turns out the Sync 3 APIM connector(along with sync 4) doesn’t even use the MSCAN pins found in the Sync 2 era car APIM harness (pins 16 and 17). I removed those from the harness and all appears well! I appreciate all your assistance in getting me this far.
Last couple questions(for now I swear!) My NAV sync 4 module has the nav page and shows my location accurately, however, there are no options to actually navigate. I also got my backup camera working, however, there are no backup lines that usually move with the steering wheel. Any help on that would be appreciated as usual.
I should also mention that I already filled in the As Built values in 05-02 through 7-04.
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I thought it was something like this, but I’m glad you found it. Good job.
It also appears that the MS-CAN connectors are shorted (terminated) in the Sync 4 APIM, good to know.
It’s ok…
You must have a NAV subscription to actually navigate and enter destinations, etc. It will never work for you, unfortunately, since this is a retrofit.
They come back most of the time after you drive it for a bit. There is no setting to force them back.
